The Clan Lord Sentinel

Michael wrote: There is no disadvantage, other than the small rank requirement, to being a ranger.

The top fighters have more champs than rangers simply because champions were out long before rangers were. A better question is how many super fighters picked being a champ over being a ranger after both were out? I dont know of any.
[...]

There were what, 6 champions before Rangers were around? So that means, every single high level fighter (except DeathLord) was able to see both Rangers and Champs before deciding.

Actually, name -one- superfighter who picked being a Ranger over a Champion. Me (if you consider me such)? Elenis (also maybe)?

Also it takes at least 300 ranks to be a decent Ranger. More if you use the morphs and such. I guess that's a small investment compared to the bonus.

That said, I agree with how the tests are done (maximum bonus is family bonus). You see how many seventh circle rangers? One I think?

(FWIW I'm nowhere close to passing 8th.)

Sala Dragon wrote: Actually, name -one- superfighter who picked being a Ranger over a Champion. Me (if you consider me such)? Elenis (also maybe)?

Kalian.

Sala Dragon wrote: Actually, name -one- superfighter who picked being a Ranger over a Champion. Me (if you consider me such)? Elenis (also maybe)?

Kalian.

Silky.

Nightbird is also training to be a Ranger right now. I can't imagine the Ranger path being very worthwhile for anyone that already has 500+ Atkus, let alone 600+, but if he can find a way for it to work out for him, then great. I think he's not planning on studying many things though, and primarily using the Goss for the original balance conservation effect. He'll probably be about as much of a "Ranger" as the current 8th circle Fighters are "Champions" (ie not at all).


I guess some of those 3 depend on what your definition of superfighter is. But it shouldn't be that big of a surprise that none/few of the very top-end Fighters chose to become Rangers. The subclass works best if you pick it up early and base all your training around it. I expect though, that Rangers will become the most numerous of those *below* the current superfighters (as in, below the Fighters that already had a ton of ranks when Rangers were introduced).

Sala Dragon wrote:Actually, name -one- superfighter who picked being a Ranger over a Champion. Me (if you consider me such)? Elenis (also maybe)?

Wait for it. By the time Rangers came about most superfighters had either chosen Champ or decided to stay the course.
What defines a 'superfighter'? 3k ranks?

Also it takes at least 300 ranks to be a decent Ranger. More if you use the morphs and such. I guess that's a small investment compared to the bonus.

Morphs require more than ranks. They require time. Morphs don't happen unless you're dedicated to the task. And have the time.
500 ranks to really make a commitment to Rangery. Those 500 are only in play about 1/4 of the time, but boy howdy do they ever play nice.

That said, I agree with how the tests are done (maximum bonus is family bonus). You see how many seventh circle rangers? One I think?

I would think that unless the Ranger trains the creatures in the test that it would be tougher for him than a Vanilla with the same # of ranks. Is there really any point in training to pass tests? What's in 8th circle that's worth the bother?

Cinnamon wrote:

Sala Dragon wrote:Actually, name -one- superfighter who picked being a Ranger over a Champion. [Answer: apparently 4 or 5]

Wait for it. By the time Rangers came about most superfighters had either chosen Champ or decided to stay the course.
What defines a 'superfighter'? 3k ranks?

My main point was just that that's not true. Only one superfighter had chosen champion before rangers were introduced.

3.5k+ ranks for sure, 3k+ is 'maybe.' I don't think any rangers are above the 3.5k mark.

I would think that unless the Ranger trains the creatures in the test that it would be tougher for him than a Vanilla with the same # of ranks. Is there really any point in training to pass tests? What's in 8th circle that's worth the bother?

That's true. I don't plan on studying any creatures to help me pass 8th (I'll study the families, but only incidentally, not because of.)

Gorvin wrote:
[Sala Dragon, Elenis Reyav]
Kalian.
Silky.

Nightbird is also training to be a Ranger right now. I can't imagine the Ranger path being very worthwhile for anyone that already has 500+ Atkus, let alone 600+, but if he can find a way for it to work out for him, then great. [...]

I guess some of those 3 depend on what your definition of superfighter is. But it shouldn't be that big of a surprise that none/few of the very top-end Fighters chose to become Rangers. The subclass works best if you pick it up early and base all your training around it. I expect though, that Rangers will become the most numerous of those *below* the current superfighters (as in, below the Fighters that already had a ton of ranks when Rangers were introduced).

[Tangent: Didn't Nightbird quit?]

I don't see Rangers as becoming the menace-to-superfighters that many seem to think.

How many up-and-coming Rangers are there? I can name a few (Blackhole, Hoggle, Rakshasa... I'll try not to ask a question about more ) but it's been close to 2 years (21 months) since Rangers were introduced, and 13 since the last balance change. I don't see any of them being picked for the kickball team before Gorvin, Gurgi, or Daimoth.

I'm certainly biased by my position in this, but I think this fear of overpowered rangers is exaggerated. On every deep Metzelti hunt I've been on, it's champions who take the forefront--not rangers. (It's pretty easy to get to the back of pretty much every monster on ZI... and everywhere else except PC/SC.)

Sala Dragon wrote:

Cinnamon wrote:

Sala Dragon wrote:Actually, name -one- superfighter who picked being a Ranger over a Champion. [Answer: apparently 4 or 5]

Wait for it. By the time Rangers came about most superfighters had either chosen Champ or decided to stay the course.
What defines a 'superfighter'? 3k ranks?

My main point was just that that's not true. Only one superfighter had chosen champion before rangers were introduced.

3.5k+ ranks for sure, 3k+ is 'maybe.' I don't think any rangers are above the 3.5k mark.

I would think that unless the Ranger trains the creatures in the test that it would be tougher for him than a Vanilla with the same # of ranks. Is there really any point in training to pass tests? What's in 8th circle that's worth the bother?

That's true. I don't plan on studying any creatures to help me pass 8th (I'll study the families, but only incidentally, not because of.)

All the current 8th circle fighters are Champions. I'd say that would qualify you are a 'super fighter'

Sala Dragon wrote: [Tangent: Didn't Nightbird quit?]

No one ever really quits. They always come back.

Kerrah wrote:

Sala Dragon wrote: [Tangent: Didn't Nightbird quit?]

No one ever really quits. They always come back.

DT needs stop setting the 'addictive' flag on all the UDP packets.

Sigh.

Chaykim wrote: All the current 8th circle fighters are Champions. I'd say that would qualify you are a 'super fighter'

Fucking pointless. Are any of them 8th circle because of their champion abilities?

In case you are confused, the answer is no.

If they all wore blue shirts and passed, would that make blue shirts over powered? Of course not, since it has nothing to do with what made them pass. You need a cause and effect, not just 2 things that happen at the same time. I bet you are a big global warming supporter.

Michael wrote:

Chaykim wrote: All the current 8th circle fighters are Champions. I'd say that would qualify you are a 'super fighter'

Fucking pointless. Are any of them 8th circle because of their champion abilities?

In case you are confused, the answer is no.

If they all wore blue shirts and passed, would that make blue shirts over powered? Of course not, since it has nothing to do with what made them pass. You need a cause and effect, not just 2 things that happen at the same time. I bet you are a big global warming supporter.

But...but...Daimoth and Gorvin have balthites.

Yes, Balthite. The ultimate iWin button.

Icy wrote: But...but...Daimoth and Gorvin have balthites. :roll:

No I don't.

Kerrah wrote:

Sala Dragon wrote: [Tangent: Didn't Nightbird quit?]

No one ever really quits. They always come back.

Uhm, the only way to confirm this is to wait until CL dies. If everyone who has left comes back by then, you're correct, but until CL dies you cannot literally say "no one ever quits".

Unless you were just joking/being cute/trying to validate your hopes that cl will never die against all logic and statisics/being witty/etc.

Frog wrote:

Kerrah wrote:

Sala Dragon wrote: [Tangent: Didn't Nightbird quit?]

No one ever really quits. They always come back.

Uhm, the only way to confirm this is to wait until CL dies. If everyone who has left comes back by then, you're correct, but until CL dies you cannot literally say "no one ever quits".

Unless you were just joking/being cute/trying to validate your hopes that cl will never die against all logic and statisics/being witty/etc.

No, idiot, I was referring to the fact that just about every single person I've heard of in the past couple of years who has "quit" and said goodbye to everyone, always has come back at least once.