The Clan Lord Sentinel

noivad wrote:Everybody gets to set one permanent BK or GK on each exile.

Yes! vote on it!

No.



Karma is meaningless. When I see a red label I have no idea why that person has it. Is he a snert? A RPer doing an evil character? Someone who simply irritated one demographic (out of several) that plays the game?



Dump Karma all together.

You left out cock stain.

I second Sareth's proposal.

I think it is a great idea (if it's even possible?).



So, you might not know the reasons someone is disliked by others... just like now. It's up to you to make your own decision from there.



A vote for good or bad karma should come with an accompanying, non-anonymous message. : "Michael's opinion of you has just been lowered." with an optional explanation.



The red name effect should be by percentage, lest Zaroff and his ilk decide that their time is best spent giving a bad vote to everyone in the lands. This would ensure that only truely disliked characters ever got red names.

As a recent newbie, I may be oversensitive, but...imagine you're new. Imagine you accidentally mess with something you shouldn't - out of ignorance, not malice. Suppose, as a result, you get a permanent BK. Will that encourage you to stay with the game?

Despite all its flaws, I think the karma system is fine the way it is now. I like being able to give out good karma to show my my appreciation to other exiles, and likewise bad karma to signal my annoyance. I know a lot of people think karma is useless, but it's a way of expressing gratitude that has a different "flavor" than just saying thanks or giving out money. Karma is fine the way it is-- just the change the bit about the red name tags, if it's such a big deal.



-Lundar

If noivad's system were implemented, I'd much rather see it use a 'toggle switch' for karma, giving folks the chance to change their opinions of exiles they've cursed/thanked previously.

like an endorsement.

How about this :



A permanent (but changeable) vote which affects the subject's karma. This represents others' opinion of the subject.



Keep old karma as it is, but with no effects. Therefore, you can still express gratitude or anger without changing your opinion of someone. I might want to curse someone who made me fall, but maybe the offense wasn't severe enough to merit an affective bad karma.

I'm willing to go along with the modification Sutai proposes. I like the current karma system, in that I find something fundamentally appealing about being able to /thank (or /curse, which I've only done once) someone. I don't think it's a useful indicator of reputation at all, but I like having a game mechanic that lets me say "your actions matter to me." Having some other game mechanic to indicate reputation (permanent but changable karma) would be nice, but I don't want to get rid of the current system, only mitigate its possible downsides. If each exile has one chance to actually affect the other person in the ways karma does now (purg time, sunstone wear, name color etc.), then the effects of karma bombing would be (relatively) reduced.

Sutai I no longer play and didn't give bad karma to people just for shits and giggles. With the exception of one to stormraven or was it ravenstorm, well one of those two.

Hex wrote:If noivad's system were implemented, I'd much rather see it use a 'toggle switch' for karma, giving folks the chance to change their opinions of exiles they've cursed/thanked previously.

I don't know if this is what Noivad had in mind, and I don't know if this is what Hex meant, but I was always felt that each individual exile should have one karma to give other exiles, and instead of having karma regenerating or decaying, you would reassign your karma from one exile to another.



Example: I could \thank Noivad, and Noivad's good karma pool would increase by one. If I were later to \thank Lundar, I would transfer my karma from Noivad to Lundar; Noivad's good karma would be reduced by one point, and Lundar's good karma would increase by one.



This karma model is different from the current karma system in a couple of ways. Karma would not "regenerate". Waiting for long periods of time would not give more karma points to give out; you simply have that one point of karma to reassign to different exiles. This would hamstring karma bombing, as the karma score of an individual would not increase with repeated \thanks or \curses. If I \thank Slyph, \thanking her again 10 minutes later does nothing, as I have already given her my one point of karma. (Maybe she would hear the "good karma" sound, but her karma score would not increase.)



With each individual exile having one point of karma to assign to another exile, this would place an artifical cap on the amount of karma that any one exile could have, as there would now be a finite amount of karma to pass around. I feel this would place more of an emphasis on the value of karma, as an exile with more bad karma than good karma would clearly indicate that this exile is disliked by more people than those who like him, rather than this exile being the victim of karma bombing.



Karma that has been assigned to an exile would still decay over time, but because there would be a finite amount of karma, perhaps it would decay at a slower rate.



Some exiles don't care about karma. Personally, I like it. I give good karma when someone does something for me that I appreciate, and I give bad karma when someone does something that I do not appreciate.

I am unclear how I feel about any of this.. there has been so much discussion that I am now lost.



The Current system sucks.. the change made it suck more.. not made it better. I really don't know what to do except that I think the concept of karma is dumb and should be removed all together from the game.



When I came on the island, people who were friendly got my attention, I didn't notice karma, I didn't actually use it for a long time. I think common sense let's newbies know who to avoid and who not to.... And I kind of think it's part of learning how to live in this new land. It was fun trying to figure out why folks thought Malkor was a crook, and even though I may have been suckered once or twice, I think it was fun.



I do not give bad karma unless two things are there. One I have to be really really pissed... Which doesn't really happen often in CL. Two I have to be close enough to sign it. I think anoncurse is for losers, and wimps. If you can't sign it don't use it.

Karma has as much meaning as you let it have.

The system works, and I don't truly mind the recent change. No dramatic changes here please.