[quote=Talin]There is a signpost in TC, whoever is out of lib and cares the tiniest least for the portal thing can come here. I am not sure how more we can get people here. BUT, there ARE more timid people, and frankly, when I see the other threads on the topic, boy, I understand well, when someone does not post. Those people may vote anonymously, but not post. So, PWC Salandra has missed one huge opportunity here. I am not going to speculate about motives here. A vote is expressing that someone took the pain to come to the forum and give a vote anonymously. Someone who may not post. We should remember though, that any PWC can have several accounts on the forum. But not including vital information just because it is difficult to interprete, I find suboptimal.[/quote]
Talin brings up some good points and I thought it might be worthwhile to start a new thread on the subject.
In my experience, polls for online games are rarely very inclusive. Not everyone reads the forums and not everyone cares enough to vote. If you've followed the forums of other games, say Blizzard games, you'll hear a lot of references to "vocal minority." Where a small percentage of people are very vocal about one thing or another, while the majority are happily enjoying whatever it is that the others are complaining about.
Another problem with polls is that they rarely have enough options to accurately reflect how people feel. For example, people might vote no because they don't like one aspect of a suggestion, but agree with the overall idea. Is their note "no" or is it really "yes, but under these circumstances"? Another problem is that many people vote before any type of discussion or they vote without reading what's actually been said (maybe they don't like the person making the suggestion, or maybe they're upset about some recent event, etc). Additionally, some people might initially vote one way and then after some discussion change they way they feel, but not take the time to change their vote. Or maybe they talk to someone in game and change their mind, but forget about the poll.
Polls can also be rigged, especially on here where they're anonymous and it's clear that people have and use multiple accounts. Talin makes an excellent point that people are reluctant to speak out (out of fear of reprisal), but that argument goes both ways (and is usually more of a problem for the people speaking out against whatever is most popular).
The final problem with polls, specifically for CL, is that they give the illusion of control. Love it or hate it, the reality is the GMs let the players resolve player issues and there really is nothing any one person can do to force another person to follow the results of a poll. Even if we somehow got everyone in the game to vote on something and it was 99% to 1%, that 1% can do anything they want. You or I don't have to agree to that, but that's how it works. Imagine now if the poll came down to 51/49. Does anyone really think that the 49% will say "we lost so lets just accept the results"?
I think polls are good for giving indications of overall interest. For example, the GMs can look at the poll on a suggestion and say "wow a lot of people are interested in this topic, maybe we need to think about it." However, I think they're kind of terrible for deciding important community things - especially when we know ahead of time that people have strong emotional responses towards what is being voted on.
That being said, no one voted me to be in charge of the current discussion or any other discussion. No one has to listen to me or do what I say - these are just my thoughts on the various subjects and not any more or less important than anyone else's. I will say, I think people have responded generally positively towards the discussion I started so that reinforced my idea that it was a good thing to do. If someone wants to make a poll (hopefully after more of the discussion has happened) then that's completely fine with me, but I wont be the one doing it for the previously stated reasons.
Talin brings up some good points and I thought it might be worthwhile to start a new thread on the subject.
In my experience, polls for online games are rarely very inclusive. Not everyone reads the forums and not everyone cares enough to vote. If you've followed the forums of other games, say Blizzard games, you'll hear a lot of references to "vocal minority." Where a small percentage of people are very vocal about one thing or another, while the majority are happily enjoying whatever it is that the others are complaining about.
Another problem with polls is that they rarely have enough options to accurately reflect how people feel. For example, people might vote no because they don't like one aspect of a suggestion, but agree with the overall idea. Is their note "no" or is it really "yes, but under these circumstances"? Another problem is that many people vote before any type of discussion or they vote without reading what's actually been said (maybe they don't like the person making the suggestion, or maybe they're upset about some recent event, etc). Additionally, some people might initially vote one way and then after some discussion change they way they feel, but not take the time to change their vote. Or maybe they talk to someone in game and change their mind, but forget about the poll.
Polls can also be rigged, especially on here where they're anonymous and it's clear that people have and use multiple accounts. Talin makes an excellent point that people are reluctant to speak out (out of fear of reprisal), but that argument goes both ways (and is usually more of a problem for the people speaking out against whatever is most popular).
The final problem with polls, specifically for CL, is that they give the illusion of control. Love it or hate it, the reality is the GMs let the players resolve player issues and there really is nothing any one person can do to force another person to follow the results of a poll. Even if we somehow got everyone in the game to vote on something and it was 99% to 1%, that 1% can do anything they want. You or I don't have to agree to that, but that's how it works. Imagine now if the poll came down to 51/49. Does anyone really think that the 49% will say "we lost so lets just accept the results"?
I think polls are good for giving indications of overall interest. For example, the GMs can look at the poll on a suggestion and say "wow a lot of people are interested in this topic, maybe we need to think about it." However, I think they're kind of terrible for deciding important community things - especially when we know ahead of time that people have strong emotional responses towards what is being voted on.
That being said, no one voted me to be in charge of the current discussion or any other discussion. No one has to listen to me or do what I say - these are just my thoughts on the various subjects and not any more or less important than anyone else's. I will say, I think people have responded generally positively towards the discussion I started so that reinforced my idea that it was a good thing to do. If someone wants to make a poll (hopefully after more of the discussion has happened) then that's completely fine with me, but I wont be the one doing it for the previously stated reasons.